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X-Men: Second Coming

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51 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:17 pm

prescribeddrone

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Why can't he touch Kitty? Fill me in on what happened when she returned. She's stuck in ghost mode or something?

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52 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:19 pm

Mnemosis

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Bingo dingo. Can't even talk, because of it.


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53 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:20 pm

prescribeddrone wrote:Why can't he touch Kitty? Fill me in on what happened when she returned. She's stuck in ghost mode or something?

Pretty much. She passed through Pitior when they tried to hug each other. She's chilling in some chamber now. I found it interesting how that moment was similar to when Magneto tried to fix up Colossus and he was paralyzed for a time (Mutant Massacre).

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54 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:22 pm

Mnemosis wrote:Bingo dingo. Can't even talk, because of it.

I didn't understand the whole "not being able to talk" part. Is this an example of a comic writer trying to use SCIENCE or did Mags mess up somehow? Or did the bullet do something? scratch

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55 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:28 pm

prescribeddrone

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Weird.

I forgot why she got stuck. Is it because the bullet had some sort of anti-phase tech so she couldn't phase through it and ended up getting stuck like that for however long she's been gone?

Or was it because she had to phase out in order to not have to eat and after staying phased out so long, she got stuck.

It has to be one of these, right?

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56 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:30 pm

LordD3r3k

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So did they reveal that Hope is Rachael Summers yet? tongue

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57 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:35 pm

Mnemosis

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Dr. Wade Fucking McNasty wrote:
Mnemosis wrote:Bingo dingo. Can't even talk, because of it.

I didn't understand the whole "not being able to talk" part. Is this an example of a comic writer trying to use SCIENCE or did Mags mess up somehow? Or did the bullet do something? scratch

The science has always been there. Kitty can't breathe while phased. If she can't breathe, she can't talk, right? Any time she HAS talked while phasing could be explained away as only being partially phased. Now, she's 100% phased, so it makes sense she can't talk.

I just don't get how she didn't die in the bullet from not breathing.

prescribeddrone wrote:Weird.

I forgot why she got stuck. Is it because the bullet had some sort of anti-phase tech so she couldn't phase through it and ended up getting stuck like that for however long she's been gone?

Or was it because she had to phase out in order to not have to eat and after staying phased out so long, she got stuck.

It has to be one of these, right?

It's the metal of the bullet. She commented on it when she first phased into it. Whether it was just a property of the alien ore, or something that was specifically done to it, it messed with her. The longer she interacted with it, the more it messed with her, it would seem.

LordD3r3k wrote:So did they reveal that Hope is Rachael Summers yet? tongue

You know, I'm to the point where I actually DON'T think it's Rachel anymore. Well, sort of. The thought lingers in my mind, but I'm no longer convinced.


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58 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:38 pm

LordD3r3k

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Mnemosis wrote:You know, I'm to the point where I actually DON'T think it's Rachel anymore. Well, sort of. The thought lingers in my mind, but I'm no longer convinced.

If it's not, it's probably because I spoiled it for them 2 years ago and they switched gears Laughing

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59 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:39 pm

prescribeddrone wrote:Weird.

I forgot why she got stuck. Is it because the bullet had some sort of anti-phase tech so she couldn't phase through it and ended up getting stuck like that for however long she's been gone?

Or was it because she had to phase out in order to not have to eat and after staying phased out so long, she got stuck.

It has to be one of these, right?

I honestly don't know. Her phasing is one power that actually confuses me mostly because it is represented so inconsistently by writers. One second she needs to hold her breath when phasing, another she can breath. One second she has to phase herslef except her feet to not fall through where she is the next second she doesn't. Continuity cries and recoils in pain when Kitty Pryde is on the scene.

LordD3r3k wrote:So did they reveal that Hope is Rachael Summers yet? tongue

Laughing

I have heard some suggestion that she is actually Hellion's and Laura's child from the future---Hellion and Laura from the future came into the past to have this baby (Hellion's mother has red hair so the genes for that are there). Why they would do that I'm not sure, but with Bishop still being alive, and seeing how relentless he is, him knowing who their parents are and possibly having maybe one last jump could create this scenario. This may explain Laura's actions as well. I'm not entirely sold on the idea but it's possible and would be interesting.

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60 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:39 pm

Mnemosis

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LordD3r3k wrote:
Mnemosis wrote:You know, I'm to the point where I actually DON'T think it's Rachel anymore. Well, sort of. The thought lingers in my mind, but I'm no longer convinced.

If it's not, it's probably because I spoiled it for them 2 years ago and they switched gears Laughing

No, they're not DC.


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61 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:42 pm

LordD3r3k

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Dr. Wade Fucking McNasty wrote: Continuity cries and recoils in pain when Kitty Pryde is on the scene.

Laughing That tickles me

Mnemosis wrote:No, they're not DC.

BOOM! You're right though, Marvel would just keep charging ahead no matter how much of a train wreck it is Wink



Last edited by LordD3r3k on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:45 pm; edited 1 time in total

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62 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:44 pm

Mnemosis wrote:
Dr. Wade Fucking McNasty wrote:
Mnemosis wrote:Bingo dingo. Can't even talk, because of it.

I didn't understand the whole "not being able to talk" part. Is this an example of a comic writer trying to use SCIENCE or did Mags mess up somehow? Or did the bullet do something? scratch

The science has always been there. Kitty can't breathe while phased. If she can't breathe, she can't talk, right? Any time she HAS talked while phasing could be explained away as only being partially phased. Now, she's 100% phased, so it makes sense she can't talk.

I just don't get how she didn't die in the bullet from not breathing.

.....I guess. My issue with partial phasing is that the mechanics of talking don't really work with a phased or partially phased individual. Then again, comic book science. Explanation enough I guess. Laughing

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63 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:51 pm

Mnemosis

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Dr. Wade Fucking McNasty wrote:
.....I guess. My issue with partial phasing is that the mechanics of talking don't really work with a phased or partially phased individual. Then again, comic book science. Explanation enough I guess. Laughing

If she's COMPLETELY intangible, how can she move air? She has to make herself at least SOMEWHAT tangible for the vibration of her vocal chords to matter.

But, by that token, if she's so completely intangible she can't talk, how is she not floating away or falling through the earth?


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64 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:59 pm

Mnemosis wrote:
Dr. Wade Fucking McNasty wrote:
.....I guess. My issue with partial phasing is that the mechanics of talking don't really work with a phased or partially phased individual. Then again, comic book science. Explanation enough I guess. Laughing

If she's COMPLETELY intangible, how can she move air? She has to make herself at least SOMEWHAT tangible for the vibration of her vocal chords to matter.

She would need her lungs to move that air though. And to have her lungs, she would need the negative pressure of her pleural cavity to keep her lungs distended along with a functioning diaphragm. If we go that far into detail, then one has to ask about nerve conduction and all that since her C3-C5 have been phased out in situations where she was talking. I agree that if she has to be partially phased to move air, my only comment is that basing any actual biological mechanics and physiology becomes shady. Suspect

This is why I never like to think of the science of some characters. Laughing


Mnemosis wrote:
But, by that token, if she's so completely intangible she can't talk, how is she not floating away or falling through the earth?

I've always wondered why she fell. It's assuming gravity was having an effect on her yet she can "air-walk". I always assumed she would remain fixed in place and the Earth would spin with her staying in place. I know she has done this before, adding to my confusion. Her falling I've assumed was due to some fluid density control, a fluid wave of phased and partially phased sections. The level of phasing is also worth considering since it is never really discussed. scratch

I'm not arguing or anything, I'm just saying. Laughing

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65 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 11:11 pm

Mnemosis

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See, I look at it like this... thinking? That's an internal bodily function. Yes, it requires science, but I'm willing to believe that the entire body is functioning uniquely. Talking requires ME to hear sound waves carried on air moved by her. Now we're talking external, so it shouldn't work. Does that make sense as a differentiation?


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66 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 11:13 pm

Mnemosis

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Same thing with Cyclops and his optic blasts. I don't ask where they come from or how they don't obliterate his skull. What I ask is why, when a battering ram is fired from a 6 foot 180 lb man into the Juggernaut, the man himself isn't hurled backwards while the Juggernaut remains unmoved?


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67 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Thu Apr 01, 2010 11:43 pm

Mnemosis wrote:See, I look at it like this... thinking? That's an internal bodily function. Yes, it requires science, but I'm willing to believe that the entire body is functioning uniquely. Talking requires ME to hear sound waves carried on air moved by her. Now we're talking external, so it shouldn't work. Does that make sense as a differentiation?

I mean it doesn't bother me that she does what she does, I just think that when we get into a more scientific discussion concerning her powers, it becomes a slippery slope. Her thinking processes are an issue as well except that she can phase other objects, big and small. All the things required for internal processes can be pahsed with her since they can exist within their closed environment. Breathing and speaking are different in that they require some interation with the outside world. She would have to selectively phase air to breath in and out. Breathing and phasing is doable but seems complex to do while doing something else. That said, I think we're saying the same thing. Laughing In any case, if she did something like that it would not "bother" me as much (again, it doesn't really bother me, just something that crosses my mind). Partial phasing would bother me since it brings in real life science that wants nothing to do with our fictional world (it even has a restraining order). I'm not saying that is canon, just commenting on my issue with that. Laughing


Mnemosis wrote:Same thing with Cyclops and his optic blasts. I don't ask where they come from or how they don't obliterate his skull. What I ask is why, when a battering ram is fired from a 6 foot 180 lb man into the Juggernaut, the man himself isn't hurled backwards while the Juggernaut remains unmoved?

His optic blasts come from another dimension. The force is sent back into the dimension. How it does not disrupt the outward flow of particles is something yet to be explained. scratch


That said, I'm waiting for someone to post that picture of that guy screaming "NERRRRRRDS!!!". Laughing

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68 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:32 am

Bigtymin504

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I I love you comic book science! Very Happy

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69 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:37 pm

LOOSECANNON

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X-Men: Second Coming #1

It’s difficult not to be terribly cautious about this particular X-event, mainly for the fact the last few crossovers—Messiah War, Utopia, Necrosha—all began on such a high note. Not steering from that notion with this issue, co-writers Kyle & Yost adequately chronicle two years of X-Men story in the midst of setting the table for Second Coming. Cable and Hope’s much anticipated arrival comes off pretty powerful, teleported at the institution that was destroyed by Magneto during Morrison’s New X-Men run, being chased by smiley Right soldiers. As soon as Cyclops finds their location via cerebra, the chase is on.

David Finch doesn’t pencil the most signature of faces (though an argument could be said for Nightcrawler), yet his “big event” artwork continues to impress. His mere presence alone recalls the greatness of the Messiah Complex, which many will say is the last stellar thing to come from the X side of Marvel. It’s only fitting that Kyle & Yost recap much of what happened since that moment while pushing the final chapter of the trilogy to the forefront. More importantly, the writing team play the character bits well: Namor’s narcissistic reception to becoming Utopia’s bodyguard; Emma’s crude leadership advice for Scott; Laura’s unrelenting behavior; Colossus’ demonstrative frustration upon Kitty Pryde's recent "phasing" arrival; and the Human Council’s riveting confidence in their legions of anti-mutant troops. Despite the chief antagonists only appearing on a single page or two, their menacing intentions prove noteworthy.

As one who’s been following the X-Men saga for some time, I can’t help but resist the temptation in feeling completely enamored by Second Coming. The creators may have erased my laughter over the joke that was X-Necrosha, yet Cyclops ogling over the messiah named “Hope” is never accurately explained. So, she’s the last born mutant after M-Day. I get that. But what does this mean for the greater good of all the mutants? Is she capable of having tons of children? Do her powers equate to producing vast amounts of these particular species? And then there’s the numbers scenario. There were 198 mutants, as we remember from David Hine’s aptly-titled mini that came off the heels of House of M. Now there are 181? Maybe a rundown of the significant of the seventeen deceased would put more of a scare into the readers than the one that Cyclops recollects at the issue’s beginning.

3.5/5 Smiley 'Bots - Placing all trifling issues aside, the X-Men: Second Coming one-shot is an ambitious beginning. Here’s to hoping the cash cow known simply as Marvel gives us an X-event worth investing.

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70 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:46 pm

Batman25JM

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^I thought the mansion was (last) destroyed during Messiah CompleX.

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71 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:24 pm

comicgeekelly

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This was pretty kick ass, but I'm worried that I'm going to miss half of Second Coming because I don't feel like adding two more books to my pull list for four months. Here's hoping that it all makes sense.

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72 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:47 pm

Bigtymin504

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I loved how Scott told Rogue to stroke Namor's ego so he would be okay with staying back to protect Utopia. Laughing Part of being a great leader is knowing how to manage all kinds of personalities, Scott is the master of that.

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73 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sun Apr 04, 2010 9:01 pm

Mnemosis

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LOOSECANNON wrote:X-Men: Second Coming #1

It’s difficult not to be terribly cautious about this particular X-event, mainly for the fact the last few crossovers—Messiah War, Utopia, Necrosha—all began on such a high note. Not steering from that notion with this issue, co-writers Kyle & Yost adequately chronicle two years of X-Men story in the midst of setting the table for Second Coming. Cable and Hope’s much anticipated arrival comes off pretty powerful, teleported at the institution that was destroyed by Magneto during Morrison’s New X-Men run, being chased by smiley Right soldiers. As soon as Cyclops finds their location via cerebra, the chase is on.

David Finch doesn’t pencil the most signature of faces (though an argument could be said for Nightcrawler), yet his “big event” artwork continues to impress. His mere presence alone recalls the greatness of the Messiah Complex, which many will say is the last stellar thing to come from the X side of Marvel. It’s only fitting that Kyle & Yost recap much of what happened since that moment while pushing the final chapter of the trilogy to the forefront. More importantly, the writing team play the character bits well: Namor’s narcissistic reception to becoming Utopia’s bodyguard; Emma’s crude leadership advice for Scott; Laura’s unrelenting behavior; Colossus’ demonstrative frustration upon Kitty Pryde's recent "phasing" arrival; and the Human Council’s riveting confidence in their legions of anti-mutant troops. Despite the chief antagonists only appearing on a single page or two, their menacing intentions prove noteworthy.

As one who’s been following the X-Men saga for some time, I can’t help but resist the temptation in feeling completely enamored by Second Coming. The creators may have erased my laughter over the joke that was X-Necrosha, yet Cyclops ogling over the messiah named “Hope” is never accurately explained. So, she’s the last born mutant after M-Day. I get that. But what does this mean for the greater good of all the mutants? Is she capable of having tons of children? Do her powers equate to producing vast amounts of these particular species? And then there’s the numbers scenario. There were 198 mutants, as we remember from David Hine’s aptly-titled mini that came off the heels of House of M. Now there are 181? Maybe a rundown of the significant of the seventeen deceased would put more of a scare into the readers than the one that Cyclops recollects at the issue’s beginning.

3.5/5 Smiley 'Bots - Placing all trifling issues aside, the X-Men: Second Coming one-shot is an ambitious beginning. Here’s to hoping the cash cow known simply as Marvel gives us an X-event worth investing.

JM's right about the mansion having been rebuilt and destroyed again, during Messiah CompleX.

As for Cyclops' faith in Hope, it's simple. He doesn't necessarily believe that SHE will turn the race around, but that she may hold the secret to their salvation. If she was born a mutant, what's special about her, and can it be farmed to birth new mutants. Not using her as a mutant womb, but possible using her for genetic samples or some such. Plus, recall, her power levels were off the charts.


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74 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Sun Apr 04, 2010 9:47 pm

LordD3r3k

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Mnemosis wrote:As for Cyclops' faith in Hope, it's simple. He doesn't necessarily believe that SHE will turn the race around, but that she may hold the secret to their salvation. If she was born a mutant, what's special about her, and can it be farmed to birth new mutants. Not using her as a mutant womb, but possible using her for genetic samples or some such. Plus, recall, her power levels were off the charts.

..and she looks like Rachel.

Laughing Wink

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75 Re: X-Men: Second Coming on Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:28 am

Mnemosis

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Yes.


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